I think the objection of "Christianity" with martial arts is the "magic" and mysticism drawn upon with regard to mind and body harmony. Learning how to punch, kick or block with good form doesn't necessarily require this, but there is always the enticement of going to the next level.
I have read Lee's book on Jeet Kun Do, and that "next level" is what it is all about though he is very typical in simultaneously affirming this and denying it. This aspect of martial arts is nothing short of mind science and mind control. A Christian is in a similar way admonished to have self-control of the spirit. The only way this can be achieved is by yielding oneself as a servant to the mastery of the soul -- mind, will, emotions.
The difference is in what we yield ourselves to. I am convinced that Lee yielded himself to death, whereas we are to yield ourselves to Christ.
Lee had a tremendous lust for power over his opponent -- power that was so supreme that it would secure him nearly instant victory. JKD was his conquest for that power. Lee learned Wing Chun but was not satisfied with the power it gave him. Jun Fan Gung Fu and then Jeet Kun Do were his way of progressively abandoning the master of Wing Chun and traditional styles in general. His "philosophy" was profoundly influenced by the writings of Jiddu Krishnamurti of whom Lee was a well studied disciple. Krishnamurti was essentially a mind-discipline guru, and probably demonized. Lee learned to abandon loyalty to the traditions of Wing Chun. Because Wing Chun had first rejected Lee (because he was not fully Chinese), it's not surprising he rebelled against rather than yield to its discipline. JKD is technically Wing Chun but with a different master or "god." That god built Lee well beyond what Wing Chun was willing to offer him but destroyed Lee through his lusts.
The JKD Krishnamurti links are extensive and deeply complex, but they are not hidden:
I maintain that truth is a pathless land, and you cannot approach it by any path whatsoever, by any religion, by any sect. That is my point of view, and I adhere to that absolutely and unconditionally. Truth, being limitless, unconditioned, unapproachable by any path whatsoever, cannot be organized; nor should any organization be formed to lead or coerce people along a particular path. - JK
"Using no way as way." "Having no limitation as limitation." "From form to formless and from finite to infinite." Jeet Kun Do: "the style of no style" -Lee
"All authority of any kind, especially in the field of thought and understanding, is the most destructive, evil thing. Leaders destroy the followers and followers destroy the leaders. You have to be your own teacher and your own disciple. -JK
I have not invented a "new style," composite, modified or otherwise that is set within distinct form as apart from "this" method or "that" method. On the contrary, I hope to free my followers from clinging to styles, patterns, or molds. Remember that Jeet Kune Do is merely a name used, a mirror in which to see "ourselves". . . Jeet Kune Do is not an organized institution that one can be a member of. Either you understand or you don't, and that is that. There is no mystery about my style. My movements are simple, direct and non-classical. The extraordinary part of it lies in its simplicity. Every movement in Jeet Kune-Do is being so of itself. -Lee
JKD, ultimately is not a matter of petty techniques but of highly developed spirituality - Lee, from The Tao of Jeet Kun Do
Parents sometimes might be lured into putting their children in the martial arts to learn respect and self-discipline. Here's my advice:
First, check to see if the reason for wanting to teach them respect is because they have not learned to submit to authority. If that is a problem, the karate teacher is not responsible for doing what God has commanded parents to do. If a child has been properly taught by his parents to honor authority, then teach him to show mercy and compassion toward others. Find some people that need it (just step outside your door) and involve your child in showing it. If it's self-respect you want to teach them, make sure they first have an accurate picture of self, then involve them in anything productive where they are contributing to the family, the church, society -- you won't have to pay them lipservice because they'll see the result and know they did it. But a karate class is just another internal program where mom and dad pay the bill and the child contributes ?
As for self-discipline, this is discipline that arises from within the self. If you are an authority like a parent, you can help your children by helping them see themselves the way they really are -- to see what is really within the self. Don’t just tell them how they are. That belittles them. Don’t just tell them to fix their outward behavior. That trains them to perform for outward appearances. Karate class at the basic levels is all about outward appearances and when it does turn to the "insides" it often does so by mysticism or worse. But you can help them see the heart from which the issues of life come out according to the truth.
Evil thoughts, murders, adulteries, fornications, thefts, false witness, blasphemies: all these things come out of the heart of children and defile them. The word of God is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart and if we look into it as into a glass that we might behold our natural face, we ought therefore to act accordingly, but if we do not do the word is it as though we walk away and forget of what manner we are. If we deceive ourselves concerning the inside of the cup, our outward appearances will be nothing more than hypocrisy. We will be like whited sepulchres. But if we clean the inside, the outside will be clean also — yea, the whole body shall be full of light.
Behold the glory of God. Only the Light of the World can make lasting internal change for the law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ. Without his heart-changing grace, all you can do is appeal to the heart of stone’s compulsive self-love, pride and egocentrism through behavioristic manipulation. The only vision your children will have is how to get what cannot satisfy -- like what Bruce Lee got. But your children can get a much greater vision than this. He is not a God who is far off.
Last edited by Ben Maulis; 08-07-2009 at 05:16 PM.
I think the objection of "Christianity" with martial arts is the "magic" and mysticism drawn upon with regard to mind and body harmony. Learning how to punch, kick or block with good form doesn't necessarily require this, but there is always the enticement of going to the next level.
I have read Lee's book on Jeet Kun Do, and that "next level" is what it is all about though he is very typical in simultaneously affirming this and denying it. This aspect of martial arts is nothing short of mind science and mind control. A Christian is in a similar way admonished to have self-control of the spirit. The only way this can be achieved is by yielding oneself as a servant to the mastery of the soul -- mind, will, emotions.
The difference is in what we yield ourselves to. I am convinced that Lee yielded himself to death, whereas we are to yield ourselves to Christ.
Lee had a tremendous lust for power over his opponent -- power that was so supreme that it would secure him nearly instant victory. JKD was his conquest for that power. Lee learned Wing Chun but was not satisfied with the power it gave him. Jun Fan Gung Fu and then Jeet Kun Do were his way of progressively abandoning the master of Wing Chun and traditional styles in general. His "philosophy" was profoundly influenced by the writings of Jiddu Krishnamurti of whom Lee was a well studied disciple. Krishnamurti was essentially a mind-discipline guru, and probably demonized. Lee learned to abandon loyalty to the traditions of Wing Chun. Because Wing Chun had first rejected Lee (because he was not fully Chinese), it's not surprising he rebelled against rather than yield to its discipline. JKD is technically Wing Chun but with a different master or "god." That god built Lee well beyond what Wing Chun was willing to offer him but destroyed Lee through his lusts.
The JKD Krishnamurti links are extensive and deeply complex, but they are not hidden:
I maintain that truth is a pathless land, and you cannot approach it by any path whatsoever, by any religion, by any sect. That is my point of view, and I adhere to that absolutely and unconditionally. Truth, being limitless, unconditioned, unapproachable by any path whatsoever, cannot be organized; nor should any organization be formed to lead or coerce people along a particular path. - JK
"Using no way as way." "Having no limitation as limitation." "From form to formless and from finite to infinite." Jeet Kun Do: "the style of no style" -Lee
"All authority of any kind, especially in the field of thought and understanding, is the most destructive, evil thing. Leaders destroy the followers and followers destroy the leaders. You have to be your own teacher and your own disciple. -JK
I have not invented a "new style," composite, modified or otherwise that is set within distinct form as apart from "this" method or "that" method. On the contrary, I hope to free my followers from clinging to styles, patterns, or molds. Remember that Jeet Kune Do is merely a name used, a mirror in which to see "ourselves". . . Jeet Kune Do is not an organized institution that one can be a member of. Either you understand or you don't, and that is that. There is no mystery about my style. My movements are simple, direct and non-classical. The extraordinary part of it lies in its simplicity. Every movement in Jeet Kune-Do is being so of itself. -Lee
JKD, ultimately is not a matter of petty techniques but of highly developed spirituality - Lee, from The Tao of Jeet Kun Do
Parents sometimes might be lured into putting their children in the martial arts to learn respect and self-discipline. Here's my advice:
First, check to see if the reason for wanting to teach them respect is because they have not learned to submit to authority. If that is a problem, the karate teacher is not responsible for doing what God has commanded parents to do. If a child has been properly taught by his parents to honor authority, then teach him to show mercy and compassion toward others. Find some people that need it (just step outside your door) and involve your child in showing it. If it's self-respect you want to teach them, make sure they first have an accurate picture of self, then involve them in anything productive where they are contributing to the family, the church, society -- you won't have to pay them lipservice because they'll see the result and know they did it. But a karate class is just another internal program where mom and dad pay the bill and the child contributes ?
As for self-discipline, this is discipline that arises from within the self. If you are an authority like a parent, you can help your children by helping them see themselves the way they really are -- to see what is really within the self. Don’t just tell them how they are. That belittles them. Don’t just tell them to fix their outward behavior. That trains them to perform for outward appearances. Karate class at the basic levels is all about outward appearances and when it does turn to the "insides" it often does so by mysticism or worse. But you can help them see the heart from which the issues of life come out according to the truth.
Evil thoughts, murders, adulteries, fornications, thefts, false witness, blasphemies: all these things come out of the heart of children and defile them. The word of God is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart and if we look into it as into a glass that we might behold our natural face, we ought therefore to act accordingly, but if we do not do the word is it as though we walk away and forget of what manner we are. If we deceive ourselves concerning the inside of the cup, our outward appearances will be nothing more than hypocrisy. We will be like whited sepulchres. But if we clean the inside, the outside will be clean also — yea, the whole body shall be full of light.
Behold the glory of God. Only the Light of the World can make lasting internal change for the law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ. Without his heart-changing grace, all you can do is appeal to the heart of stone’s compulsive self-love, pride and egocentrism through behavioristic manipulation. The only vision your children will have is how to get what cannot satisfy -- like what Bruce Lee got. But your children can get a much greater vision than this. He is not a God who is far off.
- On the cover of Bob Jones University's Spring 1992 issue of the BJU Review is a picture of black belt karate master and senior at BJU, Jim Pitts, in full karate garb, Bible open, giving the "invitation," while the rest of the members of BJU's "Champions for Christ karate team" are kneeling in prayer by their cinder-block bricks. On the inside cover is a picture of Mr. Pitts breaking four bricks with his right arm, while the other team members are watching, with Bibles open. The editor of the Review declares that:
"Champions for Christ is one of many different extension groups that go out from the University each week, bringing the Gospel to needy people throughout the Southeast. These extension ministries give all students the chance to sharpen their soulwinning skills, be an encouragement to others, and use their skills to glorify God." (Emphasis added.)
- Many other so-called youth and evangelism ministries promote the martial arts as a means of motivating youth in evangelism, spiritual warfare, etc. For example, the March 1992 Baptist Bulletin (GARBC) contains an article about a husband-wife ABWE missionary team helping "teenagers understand God's power in their lives" by exhibiting his (the husband's) karate skills ("such as breaking boards with his hands and demonstrating samurai swords and nunchakus") at GARBC youth rallies. The missionary team claims to want "to help the teenagers understand God's power in their lives ... [and] to motivate them to join God in the spiritual battle of the present age."
- Should a Christian's "soulwinning skills" include karate, and can that "skill" be used "to glorify God?" And what has karate to do with the reality of "God's power" in a teenager's life? Even though one might find it difficult to see how the so-called "skill" of karate could or would be used by the Holy Spirit to draw the lost to Christ, the overriding question must be: Is there a philosophy antithetical to Christianity that is at the root of karate exhibitions?
- Karate has a unique and unusual history. It was handed down centuries ago from Zen Master to Buddhist monk by word of mouth, and always in strict secrecy. Even today, everything done in karate can be tracked back to some principle of Zen Buddhism. An Indian Buddhist priest named Bodhidharma in the 6th century A.D. in China, synthesized karate techniques andYoga meditation in order to unite mind, spirit, and body. (Among the Chinese styles are kung fu or gung fu, wu shu, and pa kua. Tai kwan do and hapkido are among the Korean styles.) Karate is clearly a mental and moral exercise, indeed, a spiritual experience. In each practice session there is a concerted effort to unite mind, spirit, and body just as Bodhidharma sought to do with Zen priests.
Karate is founded on scientific principles of body movements that develop the karate devotee into a healthy, well coordinated person, both physically and mentally. The Chinese karate masters considered karate to be an extension of their religion. The Okinawan karate masters considered it to be a way of life:
"It is, rather, an expression of life lived 24 hours a day, 365 days a year. Indeed, the way of karate is a philosophy of life -- a rich, rewarding philosophy if carried through, past the boundaries of obvious self-defense techniques, into the realm of mind-searching discipline. Within karate-do is the potential of a new person: a person huge in all the capabilities that will make him respected and confident" (The Way of Karate).
- Karate is Zen -- so says Master Oyama and many other karate masters. Zen is a school of Buddhism that has been called the "Religion of Immediate Reality." The aim of Zen is to awaken the student to his true self and thus bring about a degree of self-knowledge through inward meditation. Zen students seek peace of mind through an enlightened awakening of an intuitive wisdom, which they feel is dormant now in all people. Zen meditation tries to achieve "no mindedness" which may be acquired by concentration and special breathing exercises. Karate, when combined with Zen meditation, is used to assist the student's quest for peace of mind and equanimity in the face of conflict and tension.
- Although many, especially here in the United States, tend to disregard much of the Zen Buddhist philosophy in their training, some impact of that philosophy is made upon every student of karate. This is because Zen meditation and yoga-like breathing exercises -- whether for thirty seconds or for two hours before and after every practice session -- are an integral part of any Oriental martial arts program. If one truly aspires to master the art of karate, he cannot ignore the spiritual implications.
Zen meditation provides a false "inner peace" that is at best a counterfeit of the peace only God can give. There is only one source of inner peace -- the Holy Spirit (Galatians 5:22). We can choose between the self-control developed by the Holy Spirit, or the self-control of Zen. And with the self-control of Zen, as with any Eastern meditation technique, one could also be opening himself up to demonic activity.
While God calls us to humility, the martial arts cater to human pride. For even in gaining mastery over one's self through Zen, it is still recognized as an accomplishment of self. That self-pride then manifests itself through a desire to prove oneself superior.
- Although some proponents for a "Christian" martial arts do concede that karate has roots in occult, pagan, and/or Eastern religious philosophy, they also claim that the primary philosophy behind the martial arts actually originated in Old Testament Biblical times (citing such passages as Gen. 14:13-16; 2 Sam 6:14; Psa. 144:1; Eccl. 9:10 as proof-texts), even going back all the way to the Garden of Eden! (Christian Martial Arts, Tottingham & Tottingham, pp. v & 2). Therefore, according to these advocates, Satan made "inroads" into the true Bible-based martial arts, capturing them for himself, and that all we need to do now is to reclaim them and change them "from an Asiatic philosophy to a truly Bible-centered Christian philosophy" (Christian Martial Arts, pp. ii & 2). Once these "dramatic changes" in "approach" are made, we are told, the "Christian can indeed study the martial arts in total harmony with his walk with the Lord" (Christian Martial Arts, p. v).
This, of course, is the same logic men use to "Christianize" any worldly, pagan, and/or occult philosophy or practice, whether it be astrology (the "Gospel in the Stars"), psychology, Eastern "medicine," magic, pyramidology, graphology, numerology, etc., etc., etc. The logic goes something like this:
"It was originated by God (which requires a few verses out of context to 'prove' it), Satan stole it and/or counterfeited it (under the false assumption that 'Satan can't create, he just steals from God'), we need to reclaim it and re-Christianize it, and then we can use it 'to glorify God'" (Christian Martial Arts, pp. 75 & 83).
- The violence associated with karate smacks of anything but "Christian." Legendary karate "masters" were reputed to have superhuman powers, including the ability to kill small birds with a yell ("the shout of doom"), a secret knowledge of how to touch lightly at a spot on the body to cause death ("the touch of death"), and the ability to penetrate an adversary's body with a bare hand to withdraw his still-beating heart. The very nature of these violent forms of expression runs counter to God's Word.
- How then can any Christian justify his involvement in karate or any of the other martial arts? He can't. Not even by claiming that such involvement is for self-defense, exercise, to learn discipline, etc. (let alone justifying it for evangelism purposes!). There are other methods by which these results may be obtained -- methods not associated with harmful violence and false doctrine.
* The chief source of our information for this report was a special report written by Albert Dager of Media Spotlight. Other sources used were various encyclopedias and three books on karate/martial arts: The Way of Karate, Karate Within Your Grasp, and Christian Martial Arts.
We use tae kwon do. The only philosophy has been love your neighbor as yourself. I will be faithful to my spouse, I will be faithful to my friends, I will respect my parents, I will respect myself, and I will respect my environment are the 5 points they must know for yellow belt. Each one of those is very biblical.
When a young person is giving parents trouble or struggling in school, the master draws alongside. They may lose a belt or behavior tape if they aren't behaving well. Our master is a very good instructor and he doesn't take misbehavior lightly.
To get black belt, a child has to be straight A's in school.
I find that encouraging Christianity is helped by the stuff he learns in tkd.
__________________
You can't reason with a rabid badger; therefore,
I have officially joined the Cabal Pact. Whoa! I feel good! I knew that I would now!
I am reasonably sure that anything I type in any of these posts is pure, unadulterated opinion.
We've been so blessed to find, 5 years ago, a Karate teacher for my husband and kids who is a very sweet Christian man. In fact, he advertised "Christian Karate." It's a mixture of different styles, which he's labeled "American Karate." It's been fantastic for my children and my husband and this man (68 years old, 3rd degree black-belt) has become a very dear friend.
__________________ Lynnea
"Captain, my religious belief teaches me to feel as safe in battle as in bed. God has fixed the time for my death. I do not concern myself about that, but to be always ready, no matter when it may overtake me." He added, after a pause, looking me full in the face: "That is the way all men should live, and then all would be equally brave."~General Stonewall Jackson~
The Glory Land, you've just cut and pasted an article from one of the biggest nut jobs to call himself a Christian in a long time, so automatically it's garbage. Plus I'd bet dollars to donuts that guy that wrote the article (his name escapes me) has never seen their demonstration in person.
Secondly, I have seen their act in person. I was at BJU when Jim Pitts and his group was going strong, and there was nothing remotely connected to eastern mysticism in their practices. Basically they karate chopped a few boards, threw each other around a little, and then preached a little sermon. I don't know how effective it was, but there was no hint of anything having to do with any religion other than the Gospel.
The Glory Land, you've just cut and pasted an article from one of the biggest nut jobs to call himself a Christian in a long time, so automatically it's garbage. Plus I'd bet dollars to donuts that guy that wrote the article (his name escapes me) has never seen their demonstration in person.
Secondly, I have seen their act in person. I was at BJU when Jim Pitts and his group was going strong, and there was nothing remotely connected to eastern mysticism in their practices. Basically they karate chopped a few boards, threw each other around a little, and then preached a little sermon. I don't know how effective it was, but there was no hint of anything having to do with any religion other than the Gospel.
You'll need to start with that article and anything else you read on his website. There isn't a religious institution or personality out there that he doesn't love to hate.
You'll need to start with that article and anything else you read on his website. There isn't a religious institution or personality out there that he doesn't love to hate.
There are some good ones out there. Don't give up so easy. Stick and stones may break my bones,but names will never hurt me.
I understand that English is your second language, so do you realize I'm not talking about you in the posts above? I'm referring to the guy that wrote that article you copied.
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Time to take the garbage out
Stick and stones may break my bones,but names will never hurt me.
Linear Mode
